Lenovo Z580

[DFergFLA]

Unable to boot from HD after install. I used a USB to boot and install Haikus rev 46993 to HD. I even used the option to "write boot sector" the HD using the Haiku installer. However, I still have to use the USB to boot. I do not get GRUB or anything. The laptop defaults to the select boot device bios screen. Boot log attatched.

[DFergFLA]

syslog

[diver]

Did you create Intel Partition Map or format the entire drive to BFS? This syslog is incomplete. Please replace it with a full one.

[DFergFLA]

I created an Intel Partition Map. Attached is a new syslog. All I am doing for this log is booting the laptop and then getting the log. If you need additional steps taken after boot but before I you the log, I need to know.

[DFergFLA]

syslog 2

[diver]

You need to install BootManager available form Installer's Tools menu.

[DFergFLA]

OK, 1st I used the USB to boot the HD Haiku and then removed the USB as soon as the haiku started booting. It boots to the desktop just fine. I then start the Installer and I get a message telling me there are no Haiku partitions, even though I am running from one. I then then open the partition manager and see the Haiku partition mounted to /boot. I then ran the BootManager install, went through all the steps, no erors. Then I rebooted without the USB. Same problem, can't boot.

[diver]

There are no Haiku partitions message means that there are no partitions you can install to because you can't install to /boot, so this message is correct. So far I can't see any reason for BootManager not to show up. Maybe try to delete Intel Partition Map using GParted or something like that and try from scratch?

[DFergFLA]

Just did that. I used GParted removed all partitions. Then formatted the RAW drive, even got the message about most people not formatting the raw drive. I then reinstalled, no errors. I even did the install boot code. Removed the USB, rebooted. Same issue as before. I can only boot using USB as the boot manager then selecting to boot from the HD, and have no idea anymore why I can't boot from the HD directly.

[diver]

Do you mean this message: "Are you sure you want to format a raw disk? (Most people initialize the disk with a partitioning system first)"? In this case you didn't create Intel Partition Map aka MBR on that disk. I wonder how did you manage to install BootManager without MBR then?

[DFergFLA]

That is a very good question for which I have no answer at this point.

So, I am in a pickle of a fix. I am unsure how to get out of it right how. I will probably delete everything and start again.

So, I want to install the entire drive, no 2nd OS. What should I do?

Initalize an Intel Partition Then Format Install ?

[DFergFLA]

Ok, I am at my wits end.

I used GParted to remove all partitions, again.

I booted from USB and ran the Installer

Init an Intel Partition Map

Formatted the entire RAW disk

Ran the install

Install the boot code.

Still can't boot from HD.

How can it be this hard to install this OS?

[DFergFLA]

I have tried this in every combination possible. I have searched the user boards, the user guides and have spent over 6 hours just today trying to get a bootable Haiku system. I install OSes for living for crying out loud. I test RAID controllers and have to install 2 different BSDs, every dang flavor of Linux out there and every release of Windows that has come out for the last 10 years. All I do is install OSes, just I can't get a working Haiku install. But at no time has Haiku indicated any problems, never an error. Just an unusable system.

[khallebal]

Replying to DFergFLA:

I have tried this in every combination possible. I have searched the user boards, the user guides and have spent over 6 hours just today trying to get a bootable Haiku system. I install OSes for living for crying out loud. I test RAID controllers and have to install 2 different BSDs, every dang flavor of Linux out there and every release of Windows that has come out for the last 10 years. All I do is install OSes, just I can't get a working Haiku install. But at no time has Haiku indicated any problems, never an error. Just an unusable system.

Try creating an empty partition(non-formatted one) using gparted then initialize it to bfs with Drivesetup then install the bootsector and the bootmanager see if it helps.

[korli]

From your last syslog "syslog 2", it seems the SSD is partitioned with efi_gpt. This doesn't look good, it should be intel.

[DFergFLA]

Ok, I have two things to do here. I can do both, but how do I make sure there isn't an efi_gpt on this HD? I am unsure at this point how it got there, I may have done it, not sure. Can I just use the installer to init Intel?

[DFergFLA]

OK, I had some time this AM and here is what I did.

1. Booted Haiku from USB
2. Created an Intel Partition Map
3. Booted from GParted
4. Created an unformated Partition
5. Booted Haiku from USB
6. Created a BeFS Partition (see screen shot)
7. Ran Installer (see Screen shot)
8. Removed USB
9. Booted (boot failed, gives me the BIOS boot selection options)
10. Booted from Haiku USB, using shift to get to boot option. The Haiku Partition is not listed as a boot option in the USB.

This is just insane. I love Haiku, when I had a laptop that it worked on it was great. I could use Haiku everyday for light things. Now that laptop is dead. I bought the next years model of the same thing, a nice generic laptop.... extreme amounts of frustration has ensued.

I am a QA Engineer by profession. This install process is at best messy, and at worst busted. Haiku is clearly not creating a bootable install but there are no messages during setup and install to indicate anything is wrong. To the contrary as a user it appears all is fine... 10 hours at this and I still can't boot from HD.

I have attached some screen shots, I didn't get a syslog because I can't boot from the HD partition at all so the syslog would only be from the USB dive and it works fine. Unless someone has a clear answer and steps to take then I am done. I am however a big, big fan of Haiku and I want to use this laptop with it. To that end. I can box up and send the laptop in its current state to any developer living in the USA or Canada with return shipping pre-paid. I would do this in hopes to both get my laptop working and hopefully resolve some issues with Haiku and make it work for even more hardware then just mine.

[tqh]

My guess is you don't install a bootloader on the disk, Only on the partition. Try installing bootman on it. Boot from USB to Desktop and install 'bootman' by running it in a terminal. It's a one time operation, and most have already some bootmanager installed on disk so it is probably not that well known. Setting up disks under Haiku could use some love, but as it is outside of the Haiku partition it's also dangerous without knowing what other OS'es have done.

[DFergFLA]

I am booted from USB. I am in the terminal I type "bootman" all lowercase. "command not found"

[diver]

bootman was renamed to BootManager a few years ago.

[DFergFLA]

OK, did it. I made no changes and just accepted the defaults. Again Haiku gave me no errors.

Same problem... again I am willing to ship this thing to a dev is someone wants to look. But at this point I am done.

[tqh]

Did you install the BootManager on the harddrive, default would probably be USB?

[DFergFLA]

I have no idea. I don't know how to tell. But between this and the problems using the touchpad it takes forever just to get anything done. I just don't have the time to mess with it anymore. Offer still stands.

[DFergFLA]

OK, I finally got it going. I have absolutely no idea how. But now I find that wireless isn't working. ARGGG!!!!!!!

[DFergFLA]

Ok, here is my final say and then as far as I am concerned this ticket can be closed.

Installing Haiku can't be left like this. At no point during any of this did Haiku itself offer any assistance/advice or an error telling me something was wrong. This is one of the first things users will do when they download Haiku. While I am pretty sure not everyone is having the issues I had. I can't imagine I will be the only one.

If a new user has this much of a problem during the first few min of having Haiku they will put it down and never look at it again. Once more the "Alt OS" community is very vocal. Haiku could get a very bad reputation right out of the gate. It may never recover from that.

I have installed at least 4 different Linux distro's, Aros and even KXlite (Amiga OS) on the HD on this laptop with only minor issues. It took me over 10 hours to get Haiku to work here and I still don't know what went wrong on why it is working now. I can't see someone who downloads, what will hopefully be Beta 1, taking hours and hours just to get it installed.

I can't offer any real suggestions on how to best handle things. I do understand that installing boot loaders and things onto peoples hardware automatically is prone with issues.

I am sure the devs who deal with Haiku all the time can easily navigate the setup and install process and it may not be a big deal to them anymore. Don't get complacent, the user experience here is very important. I don't think you want to see people who download the next release posting rants on message boards about how the install process went horribly bad for them.

[diver]

We're not saying there is no problem, it's just that it's not clear what went wrong for you. If you could pinpoint what you've done exactly to make it boot we would be able to fix it and create a smoother install experience.

[vidrep]

DFergFLA, Don't hold your breath hoping for a quick fix. I had installation issues with a pair of desktop PC's and after 20 months and 13 months respectively I am still waiting. One of them went to the recycler because I just got tired of waiting for a reply.

[DFergFLA]

@diver

Dear Lord I wish I knew, I would tell you. I just kept installing and trying different things and then suddenly it worked.

All I am saying is that if it gets to Beta 1 and people have serious issues installing, it will not be good for Haiku. What I don't know is what percentage of people may run into issues. If it is small then maybe not a really big deal. But if release is done and too many people have problems it could really be bad for Haiku. Sorry, I truly wish I could tell you more. I have put up all the syslogs I have.

I would suggest some serious QA work done by people and a private release for wider testing. That should at least tell the devs how wide spread issues are and then decide what to do. I know not a whole lot of QA Testing was done for the Alpha releases. But I would like to see some testing done, by non haiku devs, before the next release. That is all I can suggest.

[pulkomandy]

Creating an intel partition map from Haiku installs a boot loader by default, but you need to create an *active* partition for it to work. There is already a ticket about this, but we really don't want to mess with the user's setup. There can be only one active partition, so if we activate the Haiku one in a multi-boot system, we would make the other OS (eg. Windows) unbootable. This is even worse than failing to boot Haiku.

So, we need something a lot more complex: detecting wether there are other OSes installed, and in that case offering to install bootman as part of the install process.

I'm not sure what to do with this ticket now, your issue is solved and we are still not sure what you got wrong, so we don't know what to fix.

@vidrep: next time, instead of sending your hardware to the recycler, maybe consider donating or lending it to an Haiku developer. This would give a better chance of getting things fixed, it's not always easy to do so without access to the hardware. I'm starting to wonder if I'm extremely lucky with the hardware I buy, because I never had that much problems in getting Haiku to run on my systems...

[DFergFLA]

This ticket can be closed.

[vidrep]

Replying to pulkomandy:

@vidrep: next time, instead of sending your hardware to the recycler, maybe consider donating or lending it to an Haiku developer. This would give a better chance of getting things fixed, it's not always easy to do so without access to the hardware. I'm starting to wonder if I'm extremely lucky with the hardware I buy, because I never had that much problems in getting Haiku to run on my systems...

I'm sure as hell not shipping to Europe at my expense. However, kallisti5 is in Katy, Texas, which is "only" 2852 km from where I live. Even that's a stretch. I have had Haiku installed on at least six different PC's in the past 3 years, so that's probably why I see six times as many hardware related bugs as someone who uses the same system all the time.

[khallebal]

Pulkomandy:Creating an intel partition map from Haiku installs a boot loader by defaul

And that's the exactly where the problem lies when you do it with haiku's drivesetup,for some reason it doesn't initialize drives correctly, i think the bug could be in the way it writes the MBR, the user chooses a size for the partition but the end result is different once it's done,so you can't boot from it, and sometimes if you try several times(as it was the case with DFergFLA, drivesetup gets it right at some point, i hope this info could be of some help. So i suggest that we keep this ticket open until this issue with drivesetup is solved. Sorry DFergFLA if i didn't mention this clearly,i meant to tell you that, but for some i did'nt write it down.

[vidrep]

Can I be removed from the mailings for this ticket? Thanks!

[pulkomandy]

Closing as duplicate of #16304 which has a more detailed list of common user and software errors we should improve on.

Since the original reporter eventually got things to work on their machine, there isn't much more we can do here but simplify the workflow and make this more error-proof.